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Thursday, December 04, 2008

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No mention of the truly relevant side issue of IVF: how many states mandate health insurance companies cover this procedure as an illness, which cost is spread about the general premium-paying population.

Wow. I missed that NYT story but that photo speaks volumes; I don't even need to read the story. It's not the "her body, my baby" part. I'm all for the surrogate approach but did they have to dumb down the pregnant woman and upscale the apparent "virgin mary"? I guess the impact of the photo was the point, but wow, did that slap me silly! There's a whole other angle to this. Thanks for this post. I'll research and write about this. It coincides with the way motherhood is treated quite frankly: disrespectfully on various levels.

When exactly did I congratulate myself?

One clarification: the coverage of IVF is not what I was talking about; rather, treatments are mandated in 12 or more states, including New York State, where I live. My point, which I probably didn't make well enough, is that HMOs cover boner pills (Cialis, Viagra) but not fertility drugs that often have actual medical benefits for women.

But you probably knew that. You were cherrypicking to serve your own snarky ends. Buttwipe.

Daniel:

I just read your piece again, specifically looking for the key point you said you intended to make. No dice.

I searched for 'HMO,' 'Cialis,' and 'Viagra.' Nothing.

The only mention of boner pills is in the following context:

"More than 30 years since the first test-tube baby was born, people seem more reluctant to discuss IVF than boner pills or abortion."

I don't exactly see how this -- or any other statement in your article -- even BEGINS to address the issue you now claim you were really writing about.

None of the commenters on the Daily Beast seem to have picked up on your true intentions either. Just sayin'.

I'll take this slow. Pay attention.

You just quoted from one paragraph of mine to address another. I was clarifying your comments about how you object to the idea of IVF being covered by health plans. I did not address that all in my piece; but you continue to conflate the terms "fertility treatment" and "IVF treatments," and how it is or is not covered by health plans, including it seems, my own employer. I address it in the following sentence:

"The lapsed Catholic conspiracy theorist in me did notice, however, that fertility treatments weren’t covered by our health plan."

See those words, "fertility treatments"? Those are the ones I refer to in my earlier post to you. None of the commenters seem to have that kind of confusion you do. You can blog and debate and campaign against it all you want, but fertility treatments are mandated to be covered in several states.


Also: Just judging by some of the comments, it seems people still don't want talk about IVF in the normal pace of conversation. And I would love to talk more about masturbating into cups with you here. It might lighten up your blog a little bit.

Hi Daniel:

Wow, if THAT was your core argument, you couldn't have made it in a more wispy, ethereal, near-imperceptible way.

Anyway, I wasn't aware that I'd "blogged and debated and campaigned" anywhere for or against the mandated insurance coverage of fertility treatments. I wish I had an opinion on the matter (I'm not usually short on those), but I don't, and I've never touched the subject. Might you have me confused with someone else?

The only time I ever blogged about IVF was to defend the right of a woman who wanted to have the treatments. More power to her. See http://www.bakelblog.com/nobodys_business/2006/05/a_child_for_me_.html

As for your kind masturbation proposal, I'm flattered. I have a lot of fans but so far none who've fessed up to being sufficiently enamored with my blog to want to spank the monkey.

Whatever you produce, be sure to keep us updated on the consistency, volume, and approximate sperm count. We're all dying to know. I mean, why stop now, right?

Reading comprehension? Not one of your strong points, Rogier.

My mention of non-coverage of fertility treatment was mentioned just once. You are the one to make it some other argument, in your mention of argument of many.

The money issue? I'll admit: my headline reflects a much different angle than the one the DB people gave. Mine was "Out of the Petri Dish and Into the Fire." Which means that in the course of everyday, normal conversation, mentioning IVF while talking about our kid has been an a surprisingly trying minefield, one that is filled with boorish nitwits like yourself.

We saved up to do IVF; we took loans; we got some people to help us. My wife did most or all of the work.

The fact that you paid for your kid through adoption same as we did seems to underscore many of your points.

"My mention of non-coverage of fertility treatment was mentioned just once. You are the one to make it some other argument, in your mention of argument of many."

Sarah Palin, is that you?

Seriously, I don't even know what that means. You must be right about my reading comprehension!

Happy spanking,


Rogier

My mention of the our non-coverage of fertility treatment was mentioned just once. It was not my core argument at all.

You are the one to make it into some other argument.

Either way, this only underscores my real, core point: people get worked up in various ways when, in the normal, everyday conversation, we mention our kid was conceived through IVF.

The way you get worked up, apparently, is to convince yourself that I am somehow congratulating myself when I write about all this. Nothing can be further than the truth. Are you congratulating yourself when you blog every day about matters that are important to you here? According to your own logic, you might.

Keep staring at your own navel!

"my real, core point: people get worked up in various ways when, in the normal, everyday conversation, we mention our kid was conceived through IVF."

That's would be becasue your child's conception is a prvate, intimate detail that only a boor would share with someone in a normal, everyday converstion. And that is as it should be, not to keep IVF living in the shadows of shame (it does not), but to provide a sense of privacy that your new baby ( and your conversation partners) deserve. Your child deserves the opportunity to entertain a notion that they are normal, the opportunity to be grossed out thinking that thier parents did it, at least once.

On Insurance coverage: Non-IVF fertility treatments are reasonable affordable, on the order of day-care expenses once the child is born. I realize it is a shock to the insured to suddenly pay full price for a doctor's visit but I found that making those payments was a helpfull break-in period, an introduction to the economic crisis that is parenthood.

"In some circles, it might well be fashionable to discuss that little Jayden is the product of a reverse-cowgirl fuck that made his dad erupt with extraordinary propulsive power, and that little Emily is the result of a slightly mis-timed pullout one night when mom was ovulating like crazy. Pass the canapés, please!"

BEST. WRITING. EVER.

You are a fucking genius.

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